Obama wouldn’t be president if Michelle was white
I normally don’t like getting into these hypothetical race discussions, but this one is very telling: If Obama had fallen in love with a woman that looked more like his own mother, he may not have sniffed the Democratic Convention in 2004, much less received enough votes to become president back in November.
It’s no secret that people still have strong feelings against interracial marriage — specifically between a white and black person. We’ve obviously come far in these past hundred or so years where it was against the law to where a mixed-race person is our president, but we still have quite a ways to go if a man would have a strike against him if he wed a woman that had the same skin tone as his mother.
I find that a lot of the opposition would undoubtedly come from black women who, in my experience, are the most outspoken detractors of interracial mingling. Why the opposition? I can’t exactly say, although I do have my own suspicions that I outlined in my post Black women and ‘The Swirl’. To put it bluntly, the main reason why black women are so up in arms about black men’s indiscriminate choices in women is because they simply don’t have anything in common with anyone else. Either that, or just fear of ridicule from your peer group. Either way, the issue doesn’t lie with the man that decides that something as superficial as skin tone should be held against someone you choose as a mate.
At any rate, I don’t think black women alone would solely be responsible for Obama’s demise as a presidential candidate, nor do I think that they would represent the largest group in number. What I do think is that a severely disproportionate number of black women would have stayed home on election day compared to the number of whites that would have switched their vote. In other words, my guess is that 90% of black women would have changed their view of Obama compared to maybe maybe 40% of the rest of the population. Those numbers are pulled out of my rear end, so feel free to disagree with me.
The only reason why I continue to single black women out in discussions like this is that I can’t — not for the life of me — understand the continued discrimination by blacks when so many claim to face discrimination in their lives seemingly everyday. I expect the folks that have never had to face prejudice a day in their lives to continue to act like idiots, but to crawl through life moving through an obstacle course of discrimination and then to do that to someone else is inexcusable and incredibly hypocritical.
We all have some growing up to do with this whole race issue to finally mature to realize that people are people regardless of your family lineage or how dark your skin is. It’s interesting and very telling how braindead people really are when they talk so much about race being about a shared history or lineage, but these same people would say a guy like Obama would be betraying his lineage by wedding a white woman — who, according to this whole mixed up ‘race logic’, would be from the same lineage as his mother.
Anybody want to chime in and explain why your views would change of Obama if Michelle was white? Even if they wouldn’t change, I’d love to hear your view on this topic in general. Why do people still care about dating or marrying someone that doesn’t look like they could be related to you?
No related posts.
You should read more. You should talk to people from varied backgrounds instead of just hypothesizing. Oh yeah, you should read more.
“To put it bluntly, the main reason why black women are so up in arms about black men’s indiscriminate choices in women is because they simply don’t have anything in common with anyone else.”
Seriously?
Thanks for the comment Talula…
I read plenty and talk to people from as many backgrounds as I can….which is what has led me to write and think as I have. I’m always open to new opinions, so if there’s anything you’d like to present, I’d more than welcome it.
But to answer your question…yes…seriously.
Well since you have asked.
IMHO, a lot of ‘other’ people want to claim President Obama because he is just that, the president. Black women support black men, when they are broke community organizers turning down corporate America to give back to the community. So, that gives them a sense of entitlement.
I do agree that black men don’t ‘belong’ to us but some black women feel slighted when ‘others’ are only checking for a brother after he makes the headlines.
Personally, people should date who they want. All that matters is if that individual is a good person.
I just don’t agree with your premise that black women feel this way because they don’t have anything in common with anyone else. Actually, what does that line even mean?
Black women are not the only group that can be accused of this sentiment.
I’m not entirely sure what you mean by your first part about black women supporting broke black community organizers. It sounds as if you’re saying that only black women would support such a man.
To clarify my own statement about black women having things in common with non-blacks, I’ve just heard repeatedly from black women that they either don’t find white guys attractive or they just plain don’t have anything in common with them. In other words, black women feel like they’re being abandoned because the only men they are compatible with are now leaving them for other types of women. Like I said in the article, this issue doesn’t lie with the man that’s open and compatible with a varied type of woman, but with the black woman who is not broad in her taste in men.
I think black women see black men with other women and try to reflect their shortcomings onto the men rather than realize it’s them who are not joining us in the 21st century where people are judged based on what they can bring to the table regardless of their skin tone or place of origin.
And of course I realize that black women aren’t the only demographic that discriminates unnecessarily…I just happen to think that if they claim to be discriminated against themselves, that it’s especially hypocritical to take the stance they do on interracial marriage. Someone that has been taught to discriminate from day one that has never dealt with their own discrimination in the case of possibly white males is a whole different story, albeit equally as inexcusable. As with most of my topics, I just tend to talk about the ones closer to me, which is why I often single out black women.
Honestly, it comes across as if you have “something against” Black women. Allow me to clarify a few things. I can only speculate, but I am guessing that the write above who spoke about community organizers was speaking to the fact that Black women historically, have supported Black men when yes, others would not have. That when the going got real tough, they stuck around. why? There could be many reasons why, I am not quite sure. But there is something that makes Black women stay with Black men from the very beginning, when they are dirt poor, to when the make it big. now are there other women who would do this? That’s very likely. But think about it, how often does it occur, when a brother from the projects is dating a white girl when he doesn’t have a cent to his name, but only some “far-fetched dream’? I’d guess it doesn’t happen often.
And therein lies the issue. We see it our celebrities, who make it then toss away the Black girlfriends they had all their lives, for someone “different”. Could this just be that they fell for someone else? yes. But it is also possible that internalized racism is pervasive, and some Black men still believe that there is nothing better than having a white women on their arm. It could that it gives them a sense of prestige, of accomplishment, sort of like, look what i have? See, I made it.
But on to President Obama, I will say that part of his appeal for me, is the fact that he has Michelle. Call it shallow, or whatever, but it’s true. And this is because it such a rarity to see a powerful Black man with an powerful Black woman who he is obviously in love with. But more than that, it shows that the Black family does exist, that it is not a myth. This does not mean that I would not have voted for him, had his wife been anything else but Black, because I would have. It is more or less, a bonus for me.
I don’t think it is discrimination when Black women feel slighted, or betrayed. Again, we need not think that the fact that it is the 21st century is all that important. By that I mean this: you will hear a majority of people who are not Black called Pres. Obama bi-racial. you will hear a majority of Black people just call him Black. I say this because this distinction is important. Whites, or whoever who point this out, may not doing this to just be factual, but to point out the fact that he is also white, and in effect, to take away from this amazing accomplishment. Don’t believe me, you can listen to any talk radio station, or talking head, or your run of the mill person on the street, and by the tone of their voice, you can tell what they are trying to insinuate. We must ask ourselves, would the president had been elected had he been “all Black” (which is virtually impossible, but you get my drift)? This is questionable. I think that part of his appeal is the fact that he is “safe”. yes he’s Black, but hes also White. So it’s ok.
Jn 2009 we have come a long way, but not nearly long enough. Unfortunately, a majority of the road to be traveled must take place on the mental landscape, which often times has the roughest terrain to travel.
I like the way you just came at me there…pretty strong message and I can’t disagree with much….but you know I’ll try
If you speak bluntly about the way your kid is acting up in school and how he needs to get his act together, it doesn’t mean you have something against the kid. It just means you have a personal connection with the subject at hand (mother, sisters, friends) and you don’t feel like you have to hold any punches since you would expect the same from them as well.
Like I said, I single black women out a lot since it’s an issue very close to me in more than one way. I know it sounds pretty harsh, but I feel like black women that seek equality in a world historically against them are walking contradictions that have harsh feelings toward black men being with non-black women.
Sure, I agree with the above statement. I don’t however agree that TODAY, it holds as much water as it did 50 to 100 years ago. Today, we grow up in desegregated neighborhoods and schools where a black male can befriend and share a culture with both whites and blacks equally. What does this mean? It means that when it comes to “your people”, that doesn’t have to have anything to do with race. “Your people” back in the day was everybody with dark skin since they all had the same shitty experiences and lived in the same places. Nowadays, finding a woman that will be there through thick and thin doesn’t have to have anything to do with race if you grew up with a similar upbringing and were taught anything about loyalty to human beings and not just someone with a similar skin color as yourself.
Sure, this could be the case, but is it fair to lump all black men into the same sack of wrongdoing? Take it on a case by case basis and if someone does something despicable, deal with that individual. Lumping people into groups unfairly is what got us into this mess in the first place, so let’s make sure not to keep that trend rolling.
My only question to you is…why do you care if she’s black? Why don’t you care that he’s just in love and happy…period? His own mother is white, but you would only be happy if he was with a black woman…and I just want to know why that is.
I know exactly what you mean with this and I agree. But when it boils down to it, I think these whites are essentially doing the same that black people are doing: they’re trying to take credit for this man as “one of us”. In other words, the white folks may be secretly saying “it’s his whitness that makes him as great as he is”, but blacks are saying the same thing about his blackness.
I understand that it’s different in the fact that whites may actually be discrediting this historic accomplishment by saying he’s not entirely black “so it doesn’t count” or that “no full black man is ready to be president” which I just have to brush off as horseshit and keep rolling. As wrong as these folks are, I’d be talking until I’m blue in the face if I’m trying to tackle the remaining racism left over in far too many white folks out there.
Don’t take my criticisms about black women to mean that I’m ignoring the much larger issue of racism among whites. I just tend to write from an angle of things that have directly impacted my life, and the black women I’m around have had fairly strong feelings against interracial dating.
Thanks for the comment as always.
I’m a big fan of co-mingling;-)
One thing I’ve been eager to speak my mind on is the nonchalant use of racial slurs against me from blacks. I’ve heard “dego” and “guido” on several different occasions from blacks, and although it is good-natured and doesn’t bother me in the least, I am surprised by it, frankly. I don’t even care about the actual use of the slur against me, because it is not something that offends me, but why use a slur against me even jokingly when I can’t return the favor? I’m not even saying I want to be “allowed” to use slurs against black folks, because I don’t, but I always felt like black folks should be a little more sensitive to this issue.
My sentiment was that if someone does not want a certain slur to be used against them, then they should not say it themselves. Also, why keep such a nasty word alive?
The response is that using the word in a non-hateful way takes the venom out of it, but it frankly makes me feel awkward when I hear it used, even in a friendly way and by black folks.
Thanks for letting us talk about race.
I generally have a great report with black females. I find them very attractive.
Thanks for staying on topic there Brian
I thought you would kind of bring it back full circle, but you just kept rolling on racial slurs in general. Ha, it’s ok though, get it all out.
You should go ahead and write something about your experience with racial slurs and I’ll post it.
Any thoughts on the actual topic though?
@Brian
Maybe they are ignorant that these words are in fact slurs. I worked with an Italian woman who explained to me the meaning of the “D” word. I have never used it but I don’t use language like that.
Next time speak up. You have to show others how you want to be treated.
Yeah, sorry about that. I jump at the opportunity to talk about these things in an unbiased forum. They aren’t that common, so I jumped on it.
I think it’s a pretty great insight on your part to suggest that many, maybe even most, black women would have stayed home without voting if President Obama was married to a non-black woman (particularly a white woman).
I honestly could care less about the race of the woman he decides to marry. I don’t even know why it is an issue.
But like you said, we have a lot of growing up to do with regards to race. Let’s stop and think about it. Aside from a couple (or even one) completely isolated tribe, no “race” is considered pure. Italians are mixed with North Africans and Germans, Russians are mixed with Chinese and Central Asians and I know a woman from Africa (who is very dark) with a grandfather from The Netherlands. My point is that the more we study the implications of race, the more irrelevant it becomes.
It all boils down to environment, in my mind. Race only determines superficial aspects of people.
I find it very fascinating that people claim President Obama as a member of their own race. It’s funny, because the more I talk about race, the more I want to put quotes around it (“race”), because it has become so irrelevant to me. The man, in reality, was raised by white folks. He knew his Kenyan father for two weeks of his life. He grew up in Hawaii and Indonesia.
The very fact that he is considered a part of the black community directly reflects how superficial we are as a society. It is only based on the way he looks (and rightfully so, because the way he looks attracts racial hatred). When we examine the man’s background, we learn he was raised by white folks coupled with an Indonesian step-father.
We need to get over this notion of certain types of behavior being labeled as “black” or “white.” It is as silly as it sounds. Anyone who knows anything about life knows that things are very rarely “black” or “white.”
Sorry about the previous post. Like I said before, I was anxious to get some things off my chest in an unbiased forum. Hopefully this site will take off soon enough.
A-freakin-men Brian. I don’t think there’s anything I can add to that.
Interesting how interracial marriages are one of the true taboos still around. You see it in Hollywood as well. There was a rumor back in the day that Denzel had the love scene cut from the Pelican Brief cause he didn’t want to upset his black female fans. It’s rare you see a black-white pairing and even rarer that the two get it on.
Usually controversial movies aren’t so relevant forty years later but definitely Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner still rings true these days.
Yeah, you’d think we could look back on Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner and laugh, but it’s still such a taboo that it warranted a remake.
Like my fiance said, you’ll know we’ve made it as a country when we can elect an openly gay black woman with a white wife as president.
When will we be able to elect a president who is single with no children, and who openly admits he/she doesn’t want to get married and have children?
Very true…there are a lot of taboos out there that we have to overcome.
@Talulazoeapple
It is not at all the comments that bother me, because honestly, they do not at all. If someone calls me a dego or a guido, it does not, in all honesty, affect my day in the least bit.
The only point I was trying to make is the subconscious racism involved in a mentality that considers racism to be okay as long as “it’s not against us.”
It seems to reflect a general distrust of the white community that exists in the black community that I want to see disappear. Now, this can only occur if both sides are willing to admit their faults that have contributed to this malfunction in communication.
President Obama embodies the ideal situation in which one individual can literally ignite a dialogue about these topics.
I think Zaki follows in that tradition by running a website that is VERY objective and fair-minded.
Kudos to this website. Tell your friends!
“Obama was raised by white folks”. Ok, so what is your point? There are many black children who are raised by non-black parent. I fail to see the significance. What Pres. Obama did, was revert to his given name, and CHOSE to marry a black woman and move to Hyde Park in Chicago. All this is indicative a person who attempted to connect with his “other” culture.
Also, to make the sweeping statement that that a majority of black women would have stayed home if Michelle was not Black, is a gross generalization. Where are the facts? Contrary to what you may believe, we are not all the same. Nor do we think the same way, or hold the same beliefs. I would suggest getting out more, outside of your circle where you may have interaction with some Black women. Only when you get to engage with more us, will you learn how insulting your statement truly is.
Furthermore, is is no surprise that there is a”generally distrust” of the white community. Why would there not be? Are people supposed to forget about all of the negative experiences that they had, and maybe still have because Pres. Obama is in office? What has the white community done on its own to make those black citizens feel a little more comfortable? I am looking for earnest attempts, not just allowing their presence through default.
My point is that it’s absurd to look at the man differently if he married a white woman, yet so many people would do just that. Call it an over generalization if you will, but I know plenty of people that would change their view of the man had Michele been a white woman.
On the contrary, it is BECAUSE I have interacted with plenty of black women that I’m able to come to the conclusion that the vast majority of black women in this country would have a problem with the most important black man in the country being with a white woman.
If I’m wrong, I’ll stand corrected, but I challenge you to find FIVE black women that would see the man the SAME way if Michele was white. You even said it yourself that part of the appeal to Obama was that he was with Michele….not because Michele is a strong WOMAN, but because he is with a strong BLACK WOMAN. You would see him differently if Michele was white, and that only proves my point. And for an admittedly superficial reason.
People can “see” Pres. Obama anyway they want. If they “See” him differently because he is married to a white woman, that does not translate into them not voting for him. There is nothing superficial about it. I don’t understand why you have a hard time grasping that.
And regardless of how many Black women you talk to, I can rest assured that the number will in no way come close to the MAJORITY of Black women in this country. SO it remains a gross generalization. Maybe saying “some”, or, “those I have spoken to” would be more statistically accurate.
More importantly, how have you come to this conclusion? Did they conclude that they would not have voted for him, or are you assuming that they wouldn’t, based on inferences from statements that they may have made?
Pure speculation.
I have no reason to believe that the majority of black women would vote for a man that is married to a white woman, even if the man is Barack Obama. The number of black women that are OK with interracial marriage are in the MINORITY based on my experience. You’ve argued with me about it yourself about why black men would even be attracted to other races.
For you to act like what I’m saying is crazy or out of line is a little strange given your own comments on this site.
I know the onus is on me to provide significant evidence for my claim, but I don’t claim this subject to be based on anything more than my own experience. If you know of black women that would not have a problem with Obama being married to a white woman, then I’d love to hear from them on this site. I just happen to think that those women are few and far between.
Did you vote in the previous election by the way? If so, what was your reason?
Can I ask did you ask this question of the other Presidents of the United States or are you singling Obama out because he is black?? I have NEVER heard anyone ask what if George or Ronald’s wife was black
I suppose the same goes for other presidents as well, but since race has never been an issue with other presidential elections, I never really thought about it before now. So, yes, I took this opportunity to try and prove a point that I think a lot of people would not have voted for the man if he were happily married to a white woman. A very simple point which shows how far we still have to go with race relations.
Just the fact that you asked yourself that question because Obama is a black man shows “how far we still have to go with race relations”…..perhaps Mr. Zaki you need to look at the man in the mirror, you are a reflection of some of the views you detest